What is the use of God?

I have accompanied many dying people to their fate, and God seemed unimportant to them (not people around them sometimes).

Meanwhile the Muslim vs. Christian (and even Shiite vs. Sunni) debate fuels killing on a vast scale in the middle east.

AIDS spreads via a dogma that prohibits condoms, and homophobia rears it's head at the UK Lambeth conference of religious leaders.

I mean - what is the use of the almighty nowadays?

The origin of the Universe, Earth and life itself have plausible scientific explanations. Such problems used to require God to be wheeled in as an explanation. He has no stage.

Is the good from religion been outweighed by the bad nowadays?

This post has been edited by torrenter: Aug 8 2008, 09:01 PM

No use.... and yes the bad outweighs the good.

Now just get the rest of the world to agree with me and we can finally move on as a global community without being able to blame evil on some fallen angel and just accept that some people are nasty pieces of work.

Seems to me the vast majority of the faithful believe in it because they can't quite believe that their lives can be that shit while complete cranberries live out their lives in luxury. They hold to the hope of heavenly reward because their earthly existences are incredibly hard.

Undeniably jetisoning religion would be better for the vast majority but it would involve massive acts of insurrection in which many individuals would die. There'd be no point to giving the supreme being his P45 unless you were going to put a few tyrants heads on sticks as well, after all they are the ones creating the inequalities that lead to religion providing succour in the first place.

I was going to ignore this thread. It's tiresome to keep defending my faith here. But I'd just like to say that the bitterness and animosity towards those who believe in God in this forum, is wearing thin on me. It has a lot to do with why I don't post much here anymore.

I've been here for a long time. I'd like to think I can count you all as friends. I'd like to think that even though you often disagree with my conservative morals and values, that I might have earned a modicum of respect. When questions like these are posed in such a derisive manner and the atheists jump on the band wagon to agree and add further derision, it pains me to think the implications are that I personally condone religious persecutions, holy wars, bigotry, disease, and worst of all ignorance and mindless obedience to farce and dogma.

My faith is a comfort to me personally. I am strong because of it. I don't mock any of you that you don't believe. Likewise I don't blame any of you for crime, corruption, cancer, guns, armies, bombs, wars, inhumanities, etc. Not everything bad in this world is about religion.

Do you really think AIDs would go away if condoms were spread religiously? Do you really believe human beings would co-exist peacefully if there were no religion at all? Do you really believe all religious people hate homosexuals? I though you all better than that.

Would you please re-read my original post @pink? There is no generalised attack on religion or religious people there. I have given specific examples, which are surely not contentious?

There is, however a question on the usefulness of religion in general, which is not a challenge to anyone's particular faith. I think the question is a reasonable one, and suited to this forum.

Your own particular faith aside, what do you think would be the outcome if all human religions disappeared tomorrow?

Personal religion is OK. Any organisation is dangerous

Actually, Pink's right on the money... If religion disappeared tomorrow, the people who use religion badly (for whatever reason or motive) would just find something else to f*ck-up. If religion had never existed in the first place, all the wars that had ever been fought in the name of God, would just have been fought over something else... You see, the fault doesn't lie in God or the concept of God... It lies in mankind itself.

Personally, I've got no time for organised religion, but of late I've found myself increasingly asking if it all went away, would we have a net benefit or a net loss to humanity... TBH, I don't know. What I do know is, I'm no longer certain that there would be a net benefit.

Look at Pink as an example; she obviously takes great comfort from her faith, so who the f*ck is anybody to try and take that away from her by questioning the usefulness of it?

On the flip-side though, religion certainly needs to butt the f*ck out of politics, science education etc... religion only works well in a secular society. No matter how well intentioned a religion's interference in politics is, it ultimately leads to oppression like the Taliban or the Spanish Inquisition.

As the saying goes, It is OK to believe in stones, but it's not OK to throw them at people who don't.

To relieve one that somebody "knows"

to keep the poor from killing the rich.

My mum and dad are strict Baptists no TV on Sunday etc. I was brought up with a high moral code based on Baptist philosophy... I turned away from the church because it was based on a few mens interpretation of a book written 1800 years ago based on their moral values at the time... It's unfortunate that PJB is reluctant to post here as every debate benifits from the inclusion of all points of view...

I have traveled a lot and IMO the most zealous nations tent to be the poorest..... For them their religion holds their society together... So in answer to the question "what is the use of "God"" Belief in God keeps people sane who would otherwise have no hope... The fact that the rich in these countries use this as a weapon against the majority of the populous is a reflection of our failings not of religion....

This post has been edited by bigbaldybloke: Aug 10 2008, 01:06 PM

f I was the devil, I'd invent religion just to create more strife amongst peoples

I'd be interested to know how many people were bought up in a pro-religious environment or not who replied to this post. I went to a minor British public school where we had chapel every day and twice on Sundays. The people who worshiped there (or pretended to) were quite happily diddling the kids the rest of the time. To me religion means hypocrisy. Do as I say not as I do. Needless to say I have not been religious ever since. For those who have a positive experience with organized religion the opposite may be true. I always wanted to be a Jew or a Catholic as they didn't have to go to chapel. In fact, they generally went down the pub on Sundays while we Anglicans were all stuck inside listening to some interminable sermon.....

I think in a lot of places, by it's definition religion has changed and it still has a place. Sure we have science and that accounts for the things we do know but for all the questions to which we have no answer (which, for every one that gets answered a million more are asked), people will always look to a higher power.

I agree with you BD, but it's not the opposing opinions that I resent, it's the underlying bitterness towards faith in general and the continual assertion that people who believe in God are mindless. I am very happy with my faith which extends to my being very happy with my life. It's almost like atheists resent my pleasures and want me to spend more time being unhappy.

Torrenter, I can't answer your question for everyone. I can only answer it for myself since one's faith is highly personal and individual. My use for God is that I study doctrines I believe he's made available to me, interpret them as best as I understand and live my life accordingly. It works for me. I am happy and feel complete and content with my life. I am not rich by American standards but have all I need and want. I consider myself blessed by God for living as he wishes.

I was raised in a godless home. My father was atheist, my mother kept her opinions mute to appease my father. I didn't care in the least. A tragedy in my life, the death of my first child when I was 22 years old, led me to begin a quest to find a god if one existed. I investigated probably 20 different religions in the following 4 years and when my first son was 3 years old, found the LDS Church. It fit me like a glove. I have been devoutly practicing for 30 years now. I'm not the best example of my faith. I have my faults, but basically I've never regretted a moment of my life since. If it were to end tomorrow I'd meet my God and thank him for the joyful experience and hope He'd overlook my shortcomings and welcome me back home. (I think He will after a stern lecture about my naughty internet behavior. j/k )

So you made a conscious decision to choose a faith and where not forced (brainwashed) into it by your parents, which is fine. I only have a problem with people forcing their faith on others(even their own children)