What is the use of God?

Like killing all first born sons?

What about turning the other cheek?

I'm not speaking from a pro organised religious perspective, i'm speaking from a human perspective. It's silly to say that we've evolved beyond religion whilst demeaning and victimising people for their faith.

Sure, some religions have the most barbaric sentiments, but so do some pagan sects, so do atheists.

No its not, whats wrong with demeaning a BS faith? People here demean political thoughts all the time, people demean nazis, commies, capitalists, republicans, democrats, republicrats, animal rights activists, environmentalists, and on and on. So whats wrong with calling out religion? Humanity should be beyond praying to invisible men and worshiping imaginary pixies in the sky. Darwin blew all that religious BS out of the water. Not that we needed evolutionary theory to be sure of religions pure ridiculousness. I mean, come on, people still cling on to the idea that the earth is, what, 6000 years old for fuck sakes. Religion is ridiculous, it should be ridiculed.

This post has been edited by deadprez: Aug 16 2008, 06:43 PM

I understand what you're saying and I'm not saying that it's wrong to question other faiths.

My problem is with people being spat at, shouted at, assaulted, raped or murdered for their belief.

Don't get me wrong, some of the faiths need to learn restraint and acceptance as much as, if not more than, anyone else but the root cause of trouble is being intolerant of a person for being different. If someone's different who gives a damn!?

Let them read their book, pray on their matt, light their incense. Just the same as they should let you smoke your cigarette, eat your pork, work on your Saturday off or knock on wood for luck.

If more people tolerated - not liked, understood or integrated with - tolerated, the world would be a better place.

This post has been edited by m15hun: Aug 16 2008, 11:53 PM

Sorry, I posted here in reply to another post but then saw that someone else had already said what I wanted to say.

This post has been edited by Foghorn: Aug 16 2008, 10:36 PM

??? on filesoup? No one is condoning assaulting, raping, or murdering ignorant people, but calling bullshit bullshit should be encouraged. If anyone is doing the raping, murdering its the religious zealots of the world.



I give a damn when those views are pushed on me by those in power, and that churches don't pay taxes, and that one of the main goals of a lot of religions is simply to spread their shit like a virus. Missionaries, televangelists etc. If you want to believe in ghosts, zombie jesus, zeus, pixies, or whatever go ahead, but you shouldn't get any special privileges that aren't granted to other citizens. Now, brainwashing children with this drivel is yet another story, christian schools? cathlic schools, teaching creationism and such, thats another problem.

Of course not on Filesoup. But intolerance breeds contempt, then you end up with all hell breaking lose. I mean, look at the holocaust; was Hitler an atheist or a religious nutter?

.

Damn right. I agree that religious folk should tolerate too, not try to convert and harass at the door-step. I also agree that they should be party to the same tax as everyone else. With regard to the people in power comment; guaranteeing that the person in power is atheist is, to a degree, ensuring that it's your man in the hot seat and not theirs. The only fair way is to use a cabinet of people from different backgrounds, each to govern their own.

Only @pink has really answered the OP.

Religion has bettered her life, so it is a net positive force.

I would argue that a good self-help book may have done the same. Anyone disagree?

As for atheists making religious people's lives miserable - I would personally refute that!

There is, of course, the possibility that Pink DID try self help books etc and they didn't help at all... or alternatively maybe she didn't need help, she needed faith?

There is also the
arguable point that
the bible IS a self-
help book, of sorts


This post has been edited by yourmercifulgod: Aug 17 2008, 01:48 PM

Making lives miserable isn't the sole domain of the atheist. I was saying that surely, if you consider yourself more evolved, more intelligent - you should be able to live your life without being intolerant of anyone, that's the mark of enlightenment really isn't it?

Not saying you're more enlightened and then whining about other people's faiths, because that's what religious folk get vilified for..

@mh15hun: it's about absolute values vs. relative values IMHO.

Abolute morality is comfortable and; well - absolute. A movable morality is difficult, so atheists tend to be gradiose about that.

Change is always difficult, wether politics, religion or simply core values.

But is an abolutist view neessarily a bad thing?

Mod Note:

Topic split after drifting way off topic

Click here to continue discussing Hitler.

~YMG

Imagine, if you would, a bible without god. Just try it. Instead of god giving the ten commandments, some people lay down some pretty good guidelines. Hey, you shouldn't kill your neighbor, or pork his wife. Hmm, that's not a bad idea. But, man is fallible, and all he creates is also fallible. So, hey, guy with the stone tablets, i'm gonna screw your wife and kill you and you know what, there ain't really dick you can do about it. So, the meat and potatoes, the use of god. The purpose of god. Simple. Control. You might not fear me, but you might just fear god. And with fear comes power and control.

perhaps the question is not what "use" a deity is, but rather "why." why do we as a society continue to have faith

is it that the memes of faith are simply viral, overwhelming. perhaps. they just continue and perpetuate, nestling in the minds of the young, corrupting them.
or maybe, we are just born to beleive

intersting notion there, that faith in god could be an intrigal part of our dna ...
and then the thought arose from such sweet shake in times of famine
thumbprint forged of massive lipid loops that contemplate themselves
spawn unto self prior mentioned thought of pattern’s origin
and draw long from pools of man’s own mental milk to nourish self
whether blank at birth like canvas new or double helix rule
more likely mind is more like space and time and so intertwined
both playing role in proportions unknown by product of own...
kb

I'vw only skimmed this thread, but as far as I can see, k3nn one of the first non-believers here to answer the OP's question.

I like to think that God's useful as an all-encompassing meta-metaphor: he can stand in handily for whatever virtue or intention you're seeking to support. But I find it hard to explain my own argument there. Hence my earlier, glib,

History of science blogger John Wilkins had a nice little post about this yesterday though. If I read him correct, it's not God that's useful, but formal religion.

A big solid religion, with temples and rituals, evolves at the same time as settled, farming, societies*. When social groups get to the size that sort of economy requires, it's impossible to know if you can trust a stranger by reference to kinship or direct personal relationship. But, without knowing who to trust, it's going to be hard to trade. So, you need some sort of test of probity, conformity, general trustworthiness, whatever.

Formal religions create a big bunch of tests you have to pass, before you can call yourself a true believer: You have to be able to read at your Bar Mitzvah, or you need to pray five times a day, or keep the eternal flame burning, or confess your sins. If you know someone takes these tests seriously, and performs them sincerely, it's a sign you can trust them enought to trade with.

So, God's useful as a credit card for pre-cash economies.

----------------------------

*The post's actually about the World's earliest known (sacred or profane) monument, the Göbekli Tepe religious complex in Turkey. That's now been dated to around the same time as the birth of agriculture. He reckons that is evidence for religion and farming being tied intimately together.

This post has been edited by MichaelKVegfruit: Aug 21 2008, 12:50 AM